Fasting is a physical and a spiritual discipline. 30 days fasting is a refresher course every year to achieve the greater goal of piety, Taqwa, and righteousness. The words 'NOT ONLY' in the Farman is an indicator and a reminder that to achieve the highest status in spiritualism one must follow the same habits formed during the month of Ramadan that is ethical values, charity work and zikr to be continued rest of year.
Neither Imam nor Pir prohibited from fasting in the month of Ramadan. Even Pir said;
JO NAFSANIYAAT KU NAKHEY
SO SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
Pir Sadardin
Fasting
What word is used in the Quran, how is it interpreted and who is interpreting the words. This is a long debate. You have to read our history and the interpretations of the Imams of the Time. To believe or not, is your prerogative.Worldz222 wrote:Well please, can somebody tell me if physical fasting in ramadan is compulsory in ismailism or no?
People who are bent on Shariat will never understand the Farmans, at least this is was Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah said. Your question has already been answered, please read the thread and all of its messages before posting.
Ya Ali Madad:
30 day fasting in x month NOT AT ALL compulsory for ISMAILIS.the farman of Imam SMS clearly states word NOT,,it mean it was optional 100 year.a haqiqati Ismaili normal life with faith in Imam is 360 blessing like fasting.
SO WHY STRESS FOR USELESS 30 days ,when our 360 days are blessed.
30 day fasting in x month NOT AT ALL compulsory for ISMAILIS.the farman of Imam SMS clearly states word NOT,,it mean it was optional 100 year.a haqiqati Ismaili normal life with faith in Imam is 360 blessing like fasting.
SO WHY STRESS FOR USELESS 30 days ,when our 360 days are blessed.
I have read all the posts, and you guys can't even decide.Admin wrote:What word is used in the Quran, how is it interpreted and who is interpreting the words. This is a long debate. You have to read our history and the interpretations of the Imams of the Time. To believe or not, is your prerogative.Worldz222 wrote:Well please, can somebody tell me if physical fasting in ramadan is compulsory in ismailism or no?
People who are bent on Shariat will never understand the Farmans, at least this is was Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah said. Your question has already been answered, please read the thread and all of its messages before posting.
Some saying the physical fasting is compulsory some saying is not...
So i am really very confused ..
Don't be confused. In Ismailism Faith is a personal and internal matter. You have to decide what is your faith.
People may not agree, this does not mean they are confused. it means they have decided to maintain their understanding of the Faith as is their prerogative. In our faith we say "No compulsion in Faith". We believe this is Islam. We believe that this is what Allah said and we believe that this is the teaching of our Holy Prophet (PBUH).
As for you reading all of the post, allow me to doubt.
People may not agree, this does not mean they are confused. it means they have decided to maintain their understanding of the Faith as is their prerogative. In our faith we say "No compulsion in Faith". We believe this is Islam. We believe that this is what Allah said and we believe that this is the teaching of our Holy Prophet (PBUH).
As for you reading all of the post, allow me to doubt.
Ya Ali Madad:
We follow the TARIQA as set by the Imam of the time.
For a haqiqati ismalis the very same word that on the premise That Imam is speaking 100% truth ,so doubt never appeared in the first place.this does not relate to secular education of that person.
In khutba e bayn.
Hz Ali said HE IS THE CREATOR/GOD
as what level one believes or suspect it is DIRECTLY RELATED to level of it's FAITH.
Ismaili are blessed to born as an ANGELS among humans,it status and value is said in few farman of Imam SMS ,believe it or suspect it.
to sit is meditation of 1 hour at 4 am and share 12.5% of one's wealth for others 365 days in Year.
We are at MUCH MUCH MUCH higher level of practice possible is modern time.
We follow the TARIQA as set by the Imam of the time.
For a haqiqati ismalis the very same word that on the premise That Imam is speaking 100% truth ,so doubt never appeared in the first place.this does not relate to secular education of that person.
In khutba e bayn.
Hz Ali said HE IS THE CREATOR/GOD
as what level one believes or suspect it is DIRECTLY RELATED to level of it's FAITH.
Ismaili are blessed to born as an ANGELS among humans,it status and value is said in few farman of Imam SMS ,believe it or suspect it.
to sit is meditation of 1 hour at 4 am and share 12.5% of one's wealth for others 365 days in Year.
We are at MUCH MUCH MUCH higher level of practice possible is modern time.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
Pir Sadardin was a mahaan Pir of Ismailis. He performed Hujj, was Hafiz e Quran and fast in the month of Ramadan. His livelihood came from writing Quran (kitabet of Quran). These are historical facts. In his Ginans he said;
PIR SADARDIN YARA PARHEY RE QURAN.
JO NAFSANIYAAT KO NAKHEY
SO SUBB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
What I wrote above is from Satpunthi literature, nothing added from my side.
PIR SADARDIN YARA PARHEY RE QURAN.
JO NAFSANIYAAT KO NAKHEY
SO SUBB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
What I wrote above is from Satpunthi literature, nothing added from my side.
Generally we do not follow what the Pir does but what he tells us. According to MSMS Pir Sadardeen performed Ibadat for 16 hours. Most of us don't have that capacity.shivaathervedi wrote:Pir Sadardin was a mahaan Pir of Ismailis. He performed Hujj, was Hafiz e Quran and fast in the month of Ramadan. His livelihood came from writing Quran (kitabet of Quran). These are historical facts. In his Ginans he said;
PIR SADARDIN YARA PARHEY RE QURAN.
JO NAFSANIYAAT KO NAKHEY
SO SUBB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
What I wrote above is from Satpunthi literature, nothing added from my side.
Why Do Muslims Fast?1
by Seyyed Hossein Nasr
Certain truths are by nature evident and need not be discussed in normal circumstances. But, in a day and age when the most evident truths are shrouded by the clouds of doubts and questioned, one is forced to discuss even the most obvious of them. One such truth is the necessity for an ascetic element in human life. Without an element of self-denial and sceticism no religion and therefore no human culture is possible. One must withdraw occasionally from the full life of the senses even in order to be able to enjoy the fruit of sensual perception. As the Taoist saying affirms, it is the empty space of the wheel which makes the wheel. It is only a
certain degree of restraint from the material objects of the senses that makes even the life of the senses balanced, not to speak of making possible an opening in the human soul for the spiritual life.
One such practice of restraint is fasting, promulgated in Islam as obligatory for the month of Ramadan and recommended for other periods of the year. As the Holy Quran asserts, it is a practice which existed in older religions and in Islam it was only revived and institutionalised in the form of the sawm of Ramadan. Fasting during this month possesses, of course, many
social and external benefits and features which have been discussed often and in fact even somewhat overemphasised in certain quarters, where the chief virtue of fasting is reduced to charity towards the poor. This element of charity is, of course, there but like all true charity it becomes spiritually significant only when it is directed towards God. And in fasting it is the
obeying of the Divine Will which has as its fruit charity towards the poor and the needy and an actual participation in their hunger and thirst.
But the most difficult aspect of the fast is the edge of the sword of abstention directed toward the carnal soul, the al-nafs al-ammarah of the Holy Quran. In fasting, the rebellious tendencies of the carnal soul are gradually dampened and pacified through a systematic submission of
these tendencies to the Divine Will, for at every moment of hunger the soul of the Muslim is reminded that it is in order to obey a Divine Command that the passions of the carnal soul go unheeded. That is also why the fast does not include only food but also abstention from every form of lust and carnal passion.
As a result of this systematic restraint, the human soul becomes aware that it is independent of its immediate natural environment and conscious that it is in this world but not of it. A person who fasts with complete faith becomes aware very rapidly that he is a pilgrim in this world and that he is created as a creature destined for a goal beyond this material existence. The world about him loses somewhat its materiality and gains an aspect of 'vacuity' and transparence which in the case of the contemplative Muslim leads directly to a contemplation of God in His creation.
The ephemeral and 'empty' nature of things is, moreover, compensated by the appearance of those very things as Divine gifts. Food and drink which are taken for granted throughout the year reveal themselves during the period of fasting more than ever as gifts of heaven (ni'mah) and gain a spiritual significance of a sacramental nature.
To fast is also to wear the armour of purity against the passions of the world. It is to incorporate even ‘physically' in one's body the purity of death which is of course coupled with spiritual birth. In fasting, man is reminded that he has chosen the side of God over the world of passions. That
is why the Holy Prophet loved fasting so much. It was a basic element of that 'Muhammadan spiritual poverty' (faqr), about which he said, 'al-faqr fakhri' (spiritual poverty is my glory).
This death of the passions cleanses the human soul and empties it of the putrid water of its negative psychic residues. The individual and through him the Islamic community is renovated through this rite and reminded of its moral and spiritual obligations and goals. That is why the arrival of the blessed month is greeted with joy. For in it the doors of heaven are opened further for the faithful and the Divine Compassion descends upon those who seek it. To have completed the fast of Ramadan is to have undergone a rejuvenation and rebirth which prepares each Muslim to face another year with determination to live and act according to the Divine Will. The fast
also bestows a spiritual perfume upon the human soul whose fragrance can be perceived long after the period of abstinence has come to an end. It provides for the soul a source of energy upon which it feeds throughout the year. The holy month has therefore been called 'the blessed', mubarak, one in which the grace or barakah of God flows upon the Islamic community and
rejuvenates its deepest sources of life and action.
Excerpt from: Nasr, Seyyed Hossein. 1981. Islamic Life And Thought. Albany: State University 1 of New York Press.
https://www.academia.edu/33333952/Why_Do_Muslims_Fast
by Seyyed Hossein Nasr
Certain truths are by nature evident and need not be discussed in normal circumstances. But, in a day and age when the most evident truths are shrouded by the clouds of doubts and questioned, one is forced to discuss even the most obvious of them. One such truth is the necessity for an ascetic element in human life. Without an element of self-denial and sceticism no religion and therefore no human culture is possible. One must withdraw occasionally from the full life of the senses even in order to be able to enjoy the fruit of sensual perception. As the Taoist saying affirms, it is the empty space of the wheel which makes the wheel. It is only a
certain degree of restraint from the material objects of the senses that makes even the life of the senses balanced, not to speak of making possible an opening in the human soul for the spiritual life.
One such practice of restraint is fasting, promulgated in Islam as obligatory for the month of Ramadan and recommended for other periods of the year. As the Holy Quran asserts, it is a practice which existed in older religions and in Islam it was only revived and institutionalised in the form of the sawm of Ramadan. Fasting during this month possesses, of course, many
social and external benefits and features which have been discussed often and in fact even somewhat overemphasised in certain quarters, where the chief virtue of fasting is reduced to charity towards the poor. This element of charity is, of course, there but like all true charity it becomes spiritually significant only when it is directed towards God. And in fasting it is the
obeying of the Divine Will which has as its fruit charity towards the poor and the needy and an actual participation in their hunger and thirst.
But the most difficult aspect of the fast is the edge of the sword of abstention directed toward the carnal soul, the al-nafs al-ammarah of the Holy Quran. In fasting, the rebellious tendencies of the carnal soul are gradually dampened and pacified through a systematic submission of
these tendencies to the Divine Will, for at every moment of hunger the soul of the Muslim is reminded that it is in order to obey a Divine Command that the passions of the carnal soul go unheeded. That is also why the fast does not include only food but also abstention from every form of lust and carnal passion.
As a result of this systematic restraint, the human soul becomes aware that it is independent of its immediate natural environment and conscious that it is in this world but not of it. A person who fasts with complete faith becomes aware very rapidly that he is a pilgrim in this world and that he is created as a creature destined for a goal beyond this material existence. The world about him loses somewhat its materiality and gains an aspect of 'vacuity' and transparence which in the case of the contemplative Muslim leads directly to a contemplation of God in His creation.
The ephemeral and 'empty' nature of things is, moreover, compensated by the appearance of those very things as Divine gifts. Food and drink which are taken for granted throughout the year reveal themselves during the period of fasting more than ever as gifts of heaven (ni'mah) and gain a spiritual significance of a sacramental nature.
To fast is also to wear the armour of purity against the passions of the world. It is to incorporate even ‘physically' in one's body the purity of death which is of course coupled with spiritual birth. In fasting, man is reminded that he has chosen the side of God over the world of passions. That
is why the Holy Prophet loved fasting so much. It was a basic element of that 'Muhammadan spiritual poverty' (faqr), about which he said, 'al-faqr fakhri' (spiritual poverty is my glory).
This death of the passions cleanses the human soul and empties it of the putrid water of its negative psychic residues. The individual and through him the Islamic community is renovated through this rite and reminded of its moral and spiritual obligations and goals. That is why the arrival of the blessed month is greeted with joy. For in it the doors of heaven are opened further for the faithful and the Divine Compassion descends upon those who seek it. To have completed the fast of Ramadan is to have undergone a rejuvenation and rebirth which prepares each Muslim to face another year with determination to live and act according to the Divine Will. The fast
also bestows a spiritual perfume upon the human soul whose fragrance can be perceived long after the period of abstinence has come to an end. It provides for the soul a source of energy upon which it feeds throughout the year. The holy month has therefore been called 'the blessed', mubarak, one in which the grace or barakah of God flows upon the Islamic community and
rejuvenates its deepest sources of life and action.
Excerpt from: Nasr, Seyyed Hossein. 1981. Islamic Life And Thought. Albany: State University 1 of New York Press.
https://www.academia.edu/33333952/Why_Do_Muslims_Fast
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
In the said article Hussain Nasr mentioned " Fasting in the month of Ramadan is obligatory". Let me quote his two paragraphs.
One such practice of restraint is fasting, promulgated in Islam as obligatory for the month of Ramadan and recommended for other periods of the year. As the Holy Quran asserts, it is a practice which existed in older religions and in Islam it was only revived and institutionalized in the form of the sawm of Ramadan. Fasting during this month possesses, of course, many social and external benefits and features which have been discussed often and in fact even somewhat over emphasized in certain quarters, where the chief virtue of fasting is reduced to charity towards the poor. This element of charity is, of course, there but like all true charity it becomes spiritually significant only when it is directed towards God. And in fasting it is the obeying of the Divine Will which has as its fruit charity towards the poor and the needy and an actual participation in their hunger and thirst.
To fast is also to wear the armour of purity against the passions of the world. It is to incorporate even ‘physically' in one's body the purity of death which is of course coupled with spiritual birth. In fasting, man is reminded that he has chosen the side of God over the world of passions. That is why the Holy Prophet loved fasting so much. It was a basic element of that 'Muhammadan spiritual poverty' (faqr), about which he said, 'al-faqr fakhri' (spiritual poverty is my glory).
Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
One such practice of restraint is fasting, promulgated in Islam as obligatory for the month of Ramadan and recommended for other periods of the year. As the Holy Quran asserts, it is a practice which existed in older religions and in Islam it was only revived and institutionalized in the form of the sawm of Ramadan. Fasting during this month possesses, of course, many social and external benefits and features which have been discussed often and in fact even somewhat over emphasized in certain quarters, where the chief virtue of fasting is reduced to charity towards the poor. This element of charity is, of course, there but like all true charity it becomes spiritually significant only when it is directed towards God. And in fasting it is the obeying of the Divine Will which has as its fruit charity towards the poor and the needy and an actual participation in their hunger and thirst.
To fast is also to wear the armour of purity against the passions of the world. It is to incorporate even ‘physically' in one's body the purity of death which is of course coupled with spiritual birth. In fasting, man is reminded that he has chosen the side of God over the world of passions. That is why the Holy Prophet loved fasting so much. It was a basic element of that 'Muhammadan spiritual poverty' (faqr), about which he said, 'al-faqr fakhri' (spiritual poverty is my glory).
Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
kmaherali wrote:Generally we do not follow what the Pir does but what he tells us. According to MSMS Pir Sadardeen performed Ibadat for 16 hours. Most of us don't have that capacity.shivaathervedi wrote:Pir Sadardin was a mahaan Pir of Ismailis. He performed Hujj, was Hafiz e Quran and fast in the month of Ramadan. His livelihood came from writing Quran (kitabet of Quran). These are historical facts. In his Ginans he said;
PIR SADARDIN YARA PARHEY RE QURAN.
JO NAFSANIYAAT KO NAKHEY
SO SUBB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
What I wrote above is from Satpunthi literature, nothing added from my side.
DER KARDI MAHMAAN NE AATEY AATEY.....
You replied after 20 days when Ramadan is almost over, be sure it will be coming year after year.
If a momin has stamina he can do Ibadat for 16 hours. MSMS said, "TAMEY KOSHISH KARO TOU PIR SADARDIN JEVA THAI SHAKO CHHO".
The part of Ginan I mentioned above is a clear Hidayat.
This has already been addressed, please read the whole thread, your statement has already been rebuked. When you die, Allah will not ask how many Namaz or Roza you did but he will ask you what you did for mankind.shivaathervedi wrote:
Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
If you keep the intention and purpose in mind, then every moment becomes a moment of fasting. Restraint is the goal of fasting and our tariqah encourages restraint all the time. Hence it is a 365 day affair and not restricted to the month of Ramadhan.shivaathervedi wrote: Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
You cannot impose exceptional abilities of individuals as a general rule for the community. It would be like saying that because a few individuals can run the 26 mile marathon, everyone should run it!shivaathervedi wrote: If a momin has stamina he can do Ibadat for 16 hours. MSMS said, "TAMEY KOSHISH KARO TOU PIR SADARDIN JEVA THAI SHAKO CHHO".
The part of Ginan I mentioned above is a clear Hidayat.
Sure some individuals will acquire those qualities, but it is not generally within the means of evry individual.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
You wrote," But HE will ask you what you did for mankind".Admin wrote:This has already been addressed, please read the whole thread, your statement has already been rebuked. When you die, Allah will not ask how many Namaz or Roza you did but he will ask you what you did for mankind.shivaathervedi wrote:
Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
Reply: I do my best what resources I have to help mankind without creed, caste, community or religion, without aasha of reward.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
Please reread the article by Hussain Nasr which you quoted. In second paragraph it is clearly mentioned, " Fasting in the month of Ramadan is obligatory". Not only in our Tariqa but for all human beings restraint from bad deeds is must round the year.kmaherali wrote:If you keep the intention and purpose in mind, then every moment becomes a moment of fasting. Restraint is the goal of fasting and our tariqah encourages restraint all the time. Hence it is a 365 day affair and not restricted to the month of Ramadhan.shivaathervedi wrote: Fact is, for a Muslim Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
kmaherali wrote:You cannot impose exceptional abilities of individuals as a general rule for the community. It would be like saying that because a few individuals can run the 26 mile marathon, everyone should run it!shivaathervedi wrote: If a momin has stamina he can do Ibadat for 16 hours. MSMS said, "TAMEY KOSHISH KARO TOU PIR SADARDIN JEVA THAI SHAKO CHHO".
The part of Ginan I mentioned above is a clear Hidayat.
Sure some individuals will acquire those qualities, but it is not generally within the means of evry individual.
I quoted Farman of MSMS which is a kind of encouragement for murids to do ibadat sincerely. If a person can run for 26 miles marathon, he should have been practicing for years, so is the case for other people if they are willing. Where is will there is way.
When I post an article, I don't necessarily agree with everything, but there are good points he is making about self restraint etc which should be ongoing and not restricted to the month of Ramadhan.shivaathervedi wrote: Please reread the article by Hussain Nasr which you quoted. In second paragraph it is clearly mentioned, " Fasting in the month of Ramadan is obligatory". Not only in our Tariqa but for all human beings restraint from bad deeds is must round the year.
Sometimes I post articles on Christianity which have good points as well.
Of course there will be individuals who will have the motivation and the will, but you cannot say that because Pir Sadardeen performed Ibadat for 16 hours, we should all do the same. The Pir is not our model. We follow what he tells us and not what he does.shivaathervedi wrote: If a person can run for 26 miles marathon, he should have been practicing for years, so is the case for other people if they are willing. Where is will there is way.
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shivaathervedi
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- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
You wrote," The Pir is not model. We follow what he tells us and not what he does".kmaherali wrote:Of course there will be individuals who will have the motivation and the will, but you cannot say that because Pir Sadardeen performed Ibadat for 16 hours, we should all do the same. The Pir is not our model. We follow what he tells us and not what he does.shivaathervedi wrote: If a person can run for 26 miles marathon, he should have been practicing for years, so is the case for other people if they are willing. Where is will there is way.
Fine, then obey what he said:
JO NAFSIYANAAT KU NAKHEY
SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
FOLLOW ' SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY'.
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shivaathervedi
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- Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:39 pm
Please mention the points which you don't agree or contradict, so that readers should not think otherwise. There are always positive and negative aspects or points in literature.kmaherali wrote:When I post an article, I don't necessarily agree with everything, but there are good points he is making about self restraint etc which should be ongoing and not restricted to the month of Ramadhan.shivaathervedi wrote: Please reread the article by Hussain Nasr which you quoted. In second paragraph it is clearly mentioned, " Fasting in the month of Ramadan is obligatory". Not only in our Tariqa but for all human beings restraint from bad deeds is must round the year.
Sometimes I post articles on Christianity which have good points as well.
In the thread of Buj Niranjan, I expressed my view that it was not written by Pir Sadardeen. The link to the threadshivaathervedi wrote:You wrote," The Pir is not model. We follow what he tells us and not what he does".
Fine, then obey what he said:
JO NAFSIYANAAT KU NAKHEY
SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
FOLLOW ' SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY'.
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... j+niranjan
The verse you have mentioned can be translated as:
If one overcomes the lower self (nafs), it would be considered as having fasted the whole of Ramadhan.
The key is to overcome the nafs which is the essence of the fasting.
Good point, next time when I post an article, I will highlight the areas of disagreements. In this particular article I only disagree about the obligatory nature of the fasts, otherwise what he says about the purpose of the fast is excellent.shivaathervedi wrote:Please mention the points which you don't agree or contradict, so that readers should not think otherwise. There are always positive and negative aspects or points in literature.
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shivaathervedi
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You wrote," .... the purpose of the fast is excellent". It is true that fasting is to achieve the moral and ethical values as Quran described and Imam keep insisting. The fasting in the month of Ramadan is a mean to achieve the goal of TAQWA as mentioned in Quran.kmaherali wrote:Good point, next time when I post an article, I will highlight the areas of disagreements. In this particular article I only disagree about the obligatory nature of the fasts, otherwise what he says about the purpose of the fast is excellent.shivaathervedi wrote:Please mention the points which you don't agree or contradict, so that readers should not think otherwise. There are always positive and negative aspects or points in literature.
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shivaathervedi
- Posts: 1107
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kmaherali wrote:In the thread of Buj Niranjan, I expressed my view that it was not written by Pir Sadardeen. The link to the threadshivaathervedi wrote:You wrote," The Pir is not model. We follow what he tells us and not what he does".
Fine, then obey what he said:
JO NAFSIYANAAT KU NAKHEY
SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY
FOLLOW ' SUB ROZEY RAMZAN KE RAKHEY'.
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... j+niranjan
The verse you have mentioned can be translated as:
If one overcomes the lower self (nafs), it would be considered as having fasted the whole of Ramadhan.
The key is to overcome the nafs which is the essence of the fasting.
Who will decide that BUJ NIRIJIN is not written by Pir Sadardin? I don't see any Farman of MSMS and Shah Karim rejecting Buj Nirinjin.
In my opinion Buj Nirirnjin is a balanced treatise explaining Shari'at, Tariqat, Haqiqat, and Ma'rifat.
Admin is not allowing CRITICAL AND ANALYTICAL STUDY OF GINANS ON THIS FORUM. We can divide Ginans of Pir Sadardin in three stages; from conversion to transformation to Islamic Tenets and ethical values.
Regarding your translation of couplet from Buj Nirinjin regarding FASTING is your understanding otherwise meaning of that particular part is simple to understand. You are not accepting it because you are not mentally prepared for it, or may be " NAMAZ BUKHSHWANEY GAI OUUR ROZEY GALEY PAR GAI"
When I said that Buj Niranjan was not composed by Pir Sadardeen, it does not mean that it is not a work of value. Certainly it is a very enlightened work except that it was not composed by a Pir in our tradition. It might have been composed by a great Sufi. The fact that it has been retained by our tradition for generations is indicative of its great value.shivaathervedi wrote:
Who will decide that BUJ NIRIJIN is not written by Pir Sadardin? I don't see any Farman of MSMS and Shah Karim rejecting Buj Nirinjin.
In my opinion Buj Nirirnjin is a balanced treatise explaining Shari'at, Tariqat, Haqiqat, and Ma'rifat.
Admin is not allowing CRITICAL AND ANALYTICAL STUDY OF GINANS ON THIS FORUM. We can divide Ginans of Pir Sadardin in three stages; from conversion to transformation to Islamic Tenets and ethical values.
Regarding your translation of couplet from Buj Nirinjin regarding FASTING is your understanding otherwise meaning of that particular part is simple to understand. You are not accepting it because you are not mentally prepared for it, or may be " NAMAZ BUKHSHWANEY GAI OUUR ROZEY GALEY PAR GAI"
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shivaathervedi
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You wrote,:"It might have been composed by a great sufi". Will you please name that great sufi who wrote Buj Nirinjij? If that master piece is allowed to recite in khaney and explained by missionaries why not Bhajans of Mira Bai or other yogis, saints and sufis are not allowed to be recited in Khaney, there are many master pieces with great value explaining esoteric approach.kmaherali wrote:When I said that Buj Niranjan was not composed by Pir Sadardeen, it does not mean that it is not a work of value. Certainly it is a very enlightened work except that it was not composed by a Pir in our tradition. It might have been composed by a great Sufi. The fact that it has been retained by our tradition for generations is indicative of its great value.shivaathervedi wrote:
Who will decide that BUJ NIRIJIN is not written by Pir Sadardin? I don't see any Farman of MSMS and Shah Karim rejecting Buj Nirinjin.
In my opinion Buj Nirirnjin is a balanced treatise explaining Shari'at, Tariqat, Haqiqat, and Ma'rifat.
Admin is not allowing CRITICAL AND ANALYTICAL STUDY OF GINANS ON THIS FORUM. We can divide Ginans of Pir Sadardin in three stages; from conversion to transformation to Islamic Tenets and ethical values.
Regarding your translation of couplet from Buj Nirinjin regarding FASTING is your understanding otherwise meaning of that particular part is simple to understand. You are not accepting it because you are not mentally prepared for it, or may be " NAMAZ BUKHSHWANEY GAI OUUR ROZEY GALEY PAR GAI"
BUJ NIRINJIN PRINTED BY ASSOCIATIONS/ITREB BEAR THE NAME OF PIR SADARDIN.
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shivaathervedi
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The phrase 'fasting in the month of Ramadan' is available in the Quran, in sermons of Mowla Ali, Imam Baqir, Imam Ja'far, in the Fatimid literature, in Ginanic literature, and in the Farmans. Fasting in the month of Ramadan is compulsory for Muslims. Those who do not want to fast will hesitate and come up with different arguments to avoid fasting. Month of Ramadan is a kind of reminder and put them in practice so that they should continue good deeds and do ibadat round the year.kmaherali wrote:Fasting is an ongoing affair. It is not only restricted to the month of Ramadhan.shivaathervedi wrote:The fasting in the month of Ramadan is a mean to achieve the goal of TAQWA as mentioned in Quran.