Hello,
I would like to know what your views are on Sikhism. Any references of this religion from any Pirs or Imams?
I have seen interviews of MHI where he does not consider it a monothiestic religion. By this, I mean he says that Islam is the youngest of all monothiestic religions.
From my research, the Sikhs believe in the 10 Gurus... as spiritual teachers and leaders, but not Gods... their Gurus taught the notion of "one God", making Sikhism a monothiestic religion.
Your comments would be appreciated.
Thanks!
S786
Views on Sikhism
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star_munir
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From religious books of Sikhs
Words of Guru Nanak on Quran
"I have read the Bible, Tauret, zabur all these religious scriptures and have also read the vedas But in this Kaljug if there is any religious book for thorough guidance, it is only Quran."
[Vide Janam Sakhi, Bhai-Bala]
"Arabic language has 30 letters of alphabets and Quran has also 30 chapters [siparay] It is a book of admonitions and guidance. Read it, believe it perfectly well and follow it."
[Vide Janam Sakhi Kala Bhai Bala Navishta Guru Aganji]
Words of Guru Nanak on Quran
"I have read the Bible, Tauret, zabur all these religious scriptures and have also read the vedas But in this Kaljug if there is any religious book for thorough guidance, it is only Quran."
[Vide Janam Sakhi, Bhai-Bala]
"Arabic language has 30 letters of alphabets and Quran has also 30 chapters [siparay] It is a book of admonitions and guidance. Read it, believe it perfectly well and follow it."
[Vide Janam Sakhi Kala Bhai Bala Navishta Guru Aganji]
Sikhism today is the world's fifth-largest doctrinal religion, after Christianity, Islam, Hinduism and Buddhism. There are only 25 million Sikhs worldwide compared to 900 million Hindus and I billion + Muslims. I think because of their small size compared to other major faiths, MHI might not have thought them as significant as a major monotheistic faith.
Nevertheless, they consider themselves as monotheistic.
Following is an excerpt from an article, "Four centuries of Sikh scriptural wisdom -'It is the word of God, truth of truth, a beacon for all humanity'", (Calgary Herald, 5.12.2004). It explains the essentials of Sikhism.
[Despite its origins within Hinduism (and the claim of some Hindus that it is a branch of their religion), Sikhism is now strictly monotheistic, forbidding idol worship. It officially rejects the caste system and asserts the equality of men and women. In addition to the equality of all humans -- and their faiths -- Nanak enshrined basic obligations of meditating daily on God's name, living by the sweat of the brow, and sharing what is earned.....
So what do the Sikh scriptures look like? The Jap Ji, the opening verses of the Siri Guru Granth, written by the first Guru Nanak, is taken to encapsulate the entire faith:
"One Universal Creator God. The Name Is Truth. Creative Being Personified. No Fear. No Hatred. Image Of The Undying, Beyond Birth, Self-Existent. By Guru's Grace --
"True In The Primal Beginning. True Throughout The Ages.
"True Here And Now. O Nanak, Forever And Ever True.
"By thinking, He cannot be reduced to thought, even by thinking hundreds of thousands of times.
"By remaining silent, inner silence is not obtained, even by remaining lovingly absorbed deep within.
"The hunger of the hungry is not appeased, even by piling up loads of worldly goods.
"Hundreds of thousands of clever tricks, but not even one of them will go along with you in the end. ]
Pir Shamsh in the Granth "Bhrahm Prakaash", considers Nanak as an enlightened person.
or naanakshaah ne paayaa - ek naam nishva karine dhyaayaa.........................................47
And Nanak Shah attained peace, he practiced the word with conviction.
In another verse he, equates the teachings of Guru Naanak as equivalent to the Vedas and the Quran.
agam neegam puraann kuraanaa - saaheb mahimaa bhaa(n)khat naanaa....................121
Ancient sacred vedas, the Quran and the teachings of Naanak have all discussed the Divine mysteries.
The quotes from Star_Munir reinforce the beliefs that Nanak might have been a disciple of a Sufi and perhaps Pir Shamsh, and hence his veneration of the Quran.
For more, you may want to go to:
Doctrines -> Excerpts from Guru Granth Sahib of this forum.
Nevertheless, they consider themselves as monotheistic.
Following is an excerpt from an article, "Four centuries of Sikh scriptural wisdom -'It is the word of God, truth of truth, a beacon for all humanity'", (Calgary Herald, 5.12.2004). It explains the essentials of Sikhism.
[Despite its origins within Hinduism (and the claim of some Hindus that it is a branch of their religion), Sikhism is now strictly monotheistic, forbidding idol worship. It officially rejects the caste system and asserts the equality of men and women. In addition to the equality of all humans -- and their faiths -- Nanak enshrined basic obligations of meditating daily on God's name, living by the sweat of the brow, and sharing what is earned.....
So what do the Sikh scriptures look like? The Jap Ji, the opening verses of the Siri Guru Granth, written by the first Guru Nanak, is taken to encapsulate the entire faith:
"One Universal Creator God. The Name Is Truth. Creative Being Personified. No Fear. No Hatred. Image Of The Undying, Beyond Birth, Self-Existent. By Guru's Grace --
"True In The Primal Beginning. True Throughout The Ages.
"True Here And Now. O Nanak, Forever And Ever True.
"By thinking, He cannot be reduced to thought, even by thinking hundreds of thousands of times.
"By remaining silent, inner silence is not obtained, even by remaining lovingly absorbed deep within.
"The hunger of the hungry is not appeased, even by piling up loads of worldly goods.
"Hundreds of thousands of clever tricks, but not even one of them will go along with you in the end. ]
Pir Shamsh in the Granth "Bhrahm Prakaash", considers Nanak as an enlightened person.
or naanakshaah ne paayaa - ek naam nishva karine dhyaayaa.........................................47
And Nanak Shah attained peace, he practiced the word with conviction.
In another verse he, equates the teachings of Guru Naanak as equivalent to the Vedas and the Quran.
agam neegam puraann kuraanaa - saaheb mahimaa bhaa(n)khat naanaa....................121
Ancient sacred vedas, the Quran and the teachings of Naanak have all discussed the Divine mysteries.
The quotes from Star_Munir reinforce the beliefs that Nanak might have been a disciple of a Sufi and perhaps Pir Shamsh, and hence his veneration of the Quran.
For more, you may want to go to:
Doctrines -> Excerpts from Guru Granth Sahib of this forum.
kmaherali:
I don't think MHI would disclude a religion from a category because the size of their followers. In the "Is Hazar Imam God" thread, someone had quoted that MSMS had said that Ismailism will still exist even if there is one follower. I understand Ismailism is just one sect of the many that are apart of Islam, but it still sort of falls under the same.
If you have seen the interview or know what I am referring to, Hazar Imam had said something like:
"Islam is one of the youngest monothiestic religions, infact it is the youngest monothiestic religion". This interview was with Rajiv Malhotra I think. If I can find it online, I will post it.
But anyway, my point is, being a spritual leader, I don't think the Imam would have done something like what you are suggesting. I am sure there is a reason and perhaps the saying of some scholars who declare Sikhism as a sect of Hinduism, is indeed true?
Something to think about.
Thanks,
S786
I don't think MHI would disclude a religion from a category because the size of their followers. In the "Is Hazar Imam God" thread, someone had quoted that MSMS had said that Ismailism will still exist even if there is one follower. I understand Ismailism is just one sect of the many that are apart of Islam, but it still sort of falls under the same.
If you have seen the interview or know what I am referring to, Hazar Imam had said something like:
"Islam is one of the youngest monothiestic religions, infact it is the youngest monothiestic religion". This interview was with Rajiv Malhotra I think. If I can find it online, I will post it.
But anyway, my point is, being a spritual leader, I don't think the Imam would have done something like what you are suggesting. I am sure there is a reason and perhaps the saying of some scholars who declare Sikhism as a sect of Hinduism, is indeed true?
Something to think about.
Thanks,
S786
Or perhaps a hybrid of Hinduism/Sufism as the boundaries between religious communities were not clearly defined as per Dominique-Sila Khan. I would like to see MHI's statement though.s786 wrote:I am sure there is a reason and perhaps the saying of some scholars who declare Sikhism as a sect of Hinduism, is indeed true?
Something to think about.
Thanks,
S786
s786 wrote:kmaherali:
"Islam is one of the youngest monothiestic religions, infact it is the youngest monothiestic religion". This interview was with Rajiv Malhotra I think. If I can find it online, I will post it.
S786
One of the Youngest is what MHI said..
He didn't say Islam is THE YOUNGEST.
Now as I see it..it's very simple english..we don't need an Oxford or a Cambridge education to interpret and comprehend that..
He isn't excluding any religion that came after or before Islam.
Shams
http://ismaili.net/timeline/2004/20041127interview.html
I believe that is what s786 is talking about, the exact quote is:
AK: Probably I think the ethics themselves are very clear, that is, the society in which you live is the society which you care for. And there is not a great deal of distinction between whether you will care for this community or that community. What you seek is a quality of life for everybody, which is one which can be valued. So I think we have to be careful not to say that Islam is exclusive. It is not exclusive. Indeed it's probably the most inclusive of all the monotheistic faiths. If only because it was the last monotheistic faith revealed.
ShamsB: There you have it, it's in simple English.
I believe that is what s786 is talking about, the exact quote is:
AK: Probably I think the ethics themselves are very clear, that is, the society in which you live is the society which you care for. And there is not a great deal of distinction between whether you will care for this community or that community. What you seek is a quality of life for everybody, which is one which can be valued. So I think we have to be careful not to say that Islam is exclusive. It is not exclusive. Indeed it's probably the most inclusive of all the monotheistic faiths. If only because it was the last monotheistic faith revealed.
ShamsB: There you have it, it's in simple English.
In simple english..it doesn't denounce Sikhism as a monotheistic faith...zrajani wrote:http://ismaili.net/timeline/2004/20041127interview.html
I believe that is what s786 is talking about, the exact quote is:
AK: Probably I think the ethics themselves are very clear, that is, the society in which you live is the society which you care for. And there is not a great deal of distinction between whether you will care for this community or that community. What you seek is a quality of life for everybody, which is one which can be valued. So I think we have to be careful not to say that Islam is exclusive. It is not exclusive. Indeed it's probably the most inclusive of all the monotheistic faiths. If only because it was the last monotheistic faith revealed.
ShamsB: There you have it, it's in simple English.
all MHI has said is that Islam is the last monotheistic faith revealed...
Sikhism was not revealed...if you study Sikhism..you will discover that there is no concept of revealation in Sikhism..the Granth was written by Guru Nanak who was an enlightened soul as acknowledged by our Pirs in Ginans...I believe Star Munir has said in a previous post that one of his forefathers was a student of Pir Shams...Sikhism unlike Islam, Judaism and Christianity doesn't have angels appearing to humans with messages from God...
If you read the Granth in any language..you will find numerous parallels to the Quran..
in the Japji..the opening of the Guru Granth...there is amazing and astounding Parallels to Suratul Ikhlas...
"There is One Reality, the Unmanifest-Manifested,
Ever-Existent, He is Naam, The Creator, pervading all, Without fear, without enmity,
The Timeless, the Unborn and the Self-existent, Complete within itself.
Through the favour of His true Servant, the Guru, He may be realised.
He was when there was nothing.
He was before all ages began, he existeth now, O Nanak, and shall exist forevermore."
Allah is Absolute Independent in any faith.
Shams
Sikhism is not a Revealed Religion, in the sense, it was not brought by a Prophet or Messenger of God.
Guru Nanak was no doubt an enlightened soul and a Sufi.
I see his lineage of 10 Gurus as being like a Silsilah (Chain of Spiritual Leadership) of a Sufi Tariqa.
However, his followers probably turned Sikhism from a Tariqa into a whole religion.
Guru Nanak was no doubt an enlightened soul and a Sufi.
I see his lineage of 10 Gurus as being like a Silsilah (Chain of Spiritual Leadership) of a Sufi Tariqa.
However, his followers probably turned Sikhism from a Tariqa into a whole religion.
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star_munir
- Posts: 1670
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:55 am
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Guru Nanak in disguise of Haji had also visted Mecca, Khana-e-Kaaba. . He died on 5 september 1539. At that time hindus said that he was their guru and muslims said he was their saint.
Dr Iqbal in Baang-e-Dara says about him
Phir utthi akhir sada Tauheed ki Punjab say
Hind ko ek mard-e-kamil nay jagaya khuwab say
Dr Iqbal in Baang-e-Dara says about him
Phir utthi akhir sada Tauheed ki Punjab say
Hind ko ek mard-e-kamil nay jagaya khuwab say