can anybody tel me whywe do not Pray NAMAZ in our Jamat Kkana.
NAMAZ
YA ALI MADAD
have u read quranic verse,
"Obey Allah, Obey Prophet & People of the authority"
its a verse which we recite in our DUA
its Prophet/Imam of the Time which tell h0w to pray! Prophet Mohd pbuh did not pray like Prophet Moses pbuh did,nor Prophet Abrahim pbuh prayed like Adam pbuh did.
s0,what is wrong in it?? were they not Prophets of 1 GOD??
s0, we understand its Imam of the Time who will Interprate Quran n0t Molvies!
otherwise there was no need of Imam , n0r Islam can be call as Dynamic religion, it will be a static religion.
Quran never Fix or given any Fix sort of Praying ways, it just say "Pray"
it was Prophet who had told muslim h0w to pray!
regards
[/quote]
have u read quranic verse,
"Obey Allah, Obey Prophet & People of the authority"
its a verse which we recite in our DUA
its Prophet/Imam of the Time which tell h0w to pray! Prophet Mohd pbuh did not pray like Prophet Moses pbuh did,nor Prophet Abrahim pbuh prayed like Adam pbuh did.
s0,what is wrong in it?? were they not Prophets of 1 GOD??
s0, we understand its Imam of the Time who will Interprate Quran n0t Molvies!
otherwise there was no need of Imam , n0r Islam can be call as Dynamic religion, it will be a static religion.
Quran never Fix or given any Fix sort of Praying ways, it just say "Pray"
it was Prophet who had told muslim h0w to pray!
regards
[/quote]
Re: NAMAAZ
YAM,naushina wrote:Hii
am talking about Praying NAMAAZ not Reciting Dua
Whats the differnt between Dua n Namaaz.
Can anybody explain to me please?
They are different forms of prayer, their purpose though is the same - communication with God.
Re: NAMAAZ
Namaaz has never been mentioned in the Qu'ran..dua and salaat have been mentioned.naushina wrote:Hii
am talking about Praying NAMAAZ not Reciting Dua
Whats the differnt between Dua n Namaaz.
Can anybody explain to me please?
the word namaz is adopted from the persian language. it means fire worship...it was a practise of the Zorastrians who did worship fire.
also if you count the number of Quranic surahs recited in the 5 time namaz i.e. 4 surahs x 5 times a day = 20 surahs per day..
look at the dua...7 surahs x 3 times a day = 21 surahs per day...
which has more sawab?
S.
NAMAAZ
Shams<BR>r sure there is no ayat in Quran saying which should pray Namaaz/Sallat.<BR>And if u no more about Quran then which ayat say about dua.<BR>Then why all Muslim Pray Namaaz we o­nly Ismail do not Pray Nammaz.<BR><BR>Please say some commonsenses.
YA ALI MADAD
call it Namaz, call it Dua call it Salat, what is the difference?
the thing is how to Communicate with ALLAH
no where in Quran its mention how to pray/namaz/salat
Prophet told us 1400 years before
now, its Imam who tell us
what is the point of dis agreement??
i dont get it
at that Time Muslims always said "As Salam Wa Le Kum..." , today as Shia & Ismaili we say YA ALI MADAD we we meet each other, so??
please try to relate things &Y have faith / eman on Imam
i am not saying DONT ASK QUESTION, DO ASK , DO ASK what ever problem you have , but when u get some reply try to see is that a logical reply or not!
regards
call it Namaz, call it Dua call it Salat, what is the difference?
the thing is how to Communicate with ALLAH
no where in Quran its mention how to pray/namaz/salat
Prophet told us 1400 years before
now, its Imam who tell us
what is the point of dis agreement??
i dont get it
at that Time Muslims always said "As Salam Wa Le Kum..." , today as Shia & Ismaili we say YA ALI MADAD we we meet each other, so??
please try to relate things &Y have faith / eman on Imam
i am not saying DONT ASK QUESTION, DO ASK , DO ASK what ever problem you have , but when u get some reply try to see is that a logical reply or not!
regards
YA ALI MADAD
call it Namaz, call it Dua call it Salat, what is the difference?
the thing is how to Communicate with ALLAH
no where in Quran its mention how to pray/namaz/salat
Prophet told us 1400 years before
now, its Imam who tell us
what is the point of dis agreement??
i dont get it
at that Time Muslims always said "As Salam Wa Le Kum..." , today as Shia & Ismaili we say YA ALI MADAD we we meet each other, so??
please try to relate things &Y have faith / eman on Imam
i am not saying DONT ASK QUESTION, DO ASK , DO ASK what ever problem you have , but when u get some reply try to see is that a logical reply or not!
regards
call it Namaz, call it Dua call it Salat, what is the difference?
the thing is how to Communicate with ALLAH
no where in Quran its mention how to pray/namaz/salat
Prophet told us 1400 years before
now, its Imam who tell us
what is the point of dis agreement??
i dont get it
at that Time Muslims always said "As Salam Wa Le Kum..." , today as Shia & Ismaili we say YA ALI MADAD we we meet each other, so??
please try to relate things &Y have faith / eman on Imam
i am not saying DONT ASK QUESTION, DO ASK , DO ASK what ever problem you have , but when u get some reply try to see is that a logical reply or not!
regards
Re: NAMAAZ
naushina wrote:Shams<BR>r sure there is no ayat in Quran saying which should pray Namaaz/Sallat.<BR>And if u no more about Quran then which ayat say about dua.<BR>Then why all Muslim Pray Namaaz we o­nly Ismail do not Pray Nammaz.<BR><BR>Please say some commonsenses.
Actually the majority of the muslims in the middle east don't use the word Namaz for their ritual prayers...they use the word Salaat. The word namaz is used mostly by muslims of indosubpak continent origin.
There is no Standard Namaz or Salaat prescribed..everyone selects their own ayats...
there is no power of congregation....
As ismailies..we have one common dua...given to us first by Pir Sadardeen than by the Imam. each one of us says the same dua..
which if said in congregation exceeds that said solo by 27 degrees (hadith of the prophet)...
so if your namaz/salat is your own..how are you going to have the congregation follow you?
As i have stated before and many more on here..we are murids of the Imam..he says "recite dua"..i recite dua..tomorrow if he were to say stand on your head in Jamat Khana and sing britney spears...i will be there...it will not be a pretty sight...but I will be there.
With Ya Ali Madat.
Shams
Re: NAMAAZ
Dua = Prayernaushina wrote:Shams sure there is no ayat in Quran saying which should pray Namaaz/Sallat.
And if u no more about Quran then which ayat say about dua.
Then why all Muslim Pray Namaaz we only Ismail do not Pray Nammaz.
Please some commonsenses.
Salah = Prayer/Dua in congregation/Jamaat.
Pls allow me to post from an Islamic scholar & author of over 30 books - A Dr. Shabbir. Pls do read all for the "common-sense" that naushina refers to. Draw your own conclusions!
The "Imams" Mock Namaz!
Posted By: *Dr. Shabbir* - Florida
Date: Sunday, 28 May 2006, at 4:36 p.m.
THE HADITHI PUNCH LINE - NAMAZ
Let us now deal with the top Hadithi punch line. Cast any doubt on the Hadith literature before any so-called Muslim and the knee jerk response will be, “Oh, how can we pray without Hadith? The Qur’an does not tell us how to perform Namaz.”
[PARADOX: Less than 5% Muslims ‘perform’ or ‘offer’ Namaz five times a day. Yet, everybody argues about it. Less than 1% of them have ever tried to understand the Qur’an in full. Hardly 1% ever read its complete translation in their language. True, the Qur’an does not explain the method of Namaz. Did Allah forget? Or, are we missing something? Does SALAT mean NAMAZ? Or, are they two different entities? Is it possible that Namaz is a minor part of SALAT? The answers can be found in ISLAM: THE TRUE HISTORY AND FALSE BELIEFS by Shabbir Ahmed, M.D.]
THE QUESTION IS: Do the 1.4 million Ahadith give us a complete, unified, method of NAMAZ (How to pray, ‘perform’ or ‘offer NAMAZ)? The answer is a resounding NO!
- Please remind yourself of the famous, weird tale of the Prophet (S) ascending to heavens to meet with Allah, the so-called Me'raaj (the word is non-existent in the Qur'an). Is not Allah Omnipresent?
The "Imams" of Hadith want us to believe that Allah ordained 50 ritual prayers daily for Muslims on that occasion. As the exalted Prophet was descending from the highest sky, Prophet Moses told him of the impossibility of the situation and sent Muhammad (S) back again and again. Imagine the Prophet (S) bargaining with God! Repeated visits to and fro then bring the number down to 40, 30, 20, 10, (elsewhere, from 50 down to half and again to another half and so on), finally to 5! Allah also said, “These are five and these are fifty. I do not alter My Word.” Moses a. s. wanted him to make one more trip but Muhammad (S) said, “I feel shy of my Lord” (to go back and bargain any further.)
Was this Hadith, in addition to promoting ritualism, fabricated to prove the superiority of Muhammad (S) over Moses a.s. and even God? Only an extremely gullible mind would accept this nonsensical story. (See Bukhari vol 1 Kitab-us-Salat pg 215 Hadith 339 for exact details)
So, neither Allah nor Rasool had any idea of human limitations. Had Moses not intervened, the Ummah would be praying a non-stop 24 hours day and night. Thank Moses a. s. for being the instructor of Allah and Rasool. Thank him for saving Islam from their blunder. What mockery! Think! Allah also said, “These are five and these are fifty. I do not alter My Word.”
But the story has just begun. Let us see a little more closely what Hadith has to offer about teaching us NAMAZ.
- Hazrat Anas said: The Prophet (S) used to do a new Wudhu (ablution) for every Namaz. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 35)
- Contradiction - Hazrat Ibn Abbas said: Rasool (S) slept for a while - went to the Masjid and prayed (‘offered’ Namaz) without Wudhu. (Bukhari, Kitabul Wudhu)
- The Sahaba of Rasool (S) used to ‘perform’ Namaz without Wudhu after waking up from sleep. (Muslim with Fathil Mulhim pg 500)
Is Ghusl (bath) mandatory after intercourse?
- Hazrat Usman said: If a man withdraws before ejaculation, let him wash the genitals and make Wudhu (No bath necessary). (Bukhari, vol 1 Kitabul Wudhu pg 164 Hadith 176)
- Bath becomes mandatory after penetration. (Muwatta pg 22)
- Rasool (S) said: When a man sits between the woman’s legs and pushes hard, Ghusl (bath) becomes mandatory with or without ejaculation. (Muslim vol 1 Bab-il-Wudhu pg 485)
- Ubbi bin Ka’ab asked Rasoolullah (S), “If a man engages in intercourse and withdraws before ejaculation, should he take bath?” He replied, “He should do Wudhu and pray.”
[Now what conclusion can we reach if any?! Would the great men who conquered 1/3rd of the world and their hearts and became teachers of humanity, indulge in such trivia and nonsense?]
- Rasool (S) said, “Renew Wudhu after eating anything cooked on fire.” (Muslim vol 1 pg 486)
- BUT - Ibn Abbas says, “Rasoolullah ate a roasted goat shoulder and then prayed without ablution.” (Same vol 1 pg 488)
- Hazrat Bilal was ordered to say two Takbeers in Azaan and one in Iqaamat. (Muslim vol 2 pg 2) Why do Muslims say two Takbeers in Iqaamat? There must be another Hadith contradicting this one.
- When asked what to recite after Surah Fatihah in Namaz, Abu Hurairah said, “Reciting any Surah is good but Al-Fatihah is sufficient.” (Muslim vol 2 pg 31) The Imams of FIQH maintain that Al-Fatihah is not sufficient.
- Hazrat Umar used to recite “Subhaanakallahumma ---” loudly. (Muslim vol 2 pg 38) The Imams tell us to recite it in the heart.
- Hazrat Anas said, “I prayed behind Rasoolullah, Abu Bakr, Umar and Usman. They used to begin Namaz with Al-Fatihah.” No Subhanakallahumma ---. (Muslim vol 2 pg 38)
- When the pulpit was built in Masjid Nabawi, the Rasool climbed on it, turned to the Qiblah, said Takbeer and people got arranged in columns. After recitation, he bowed on his knees, then came down, prostrated on the ground, then again climbed on the pulpit. He did bow (did rukoo’) again and then came down for prostration on the ground. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 53) What! Say that again.
- Rasoolullah picked up his daughter Zainab’s little girl Amama and began praying. When he went into Sajdah (prostration) he placed her on the ground and when he got up, he picked her up again. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 69)
- If someone passes in front of a praying person, stop him. If he doesn’t stop, kill him because he is Shayitaan. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 68)
- But: Abdullah Ibn Abbas said, “I rode a she-ass to MINA. Rasoolullah (S) was leading the prayer. I passed before some praying ones and got off from the animal and joined the prayers. None objected. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 107)
- Hazrat Sa’d bin Abi Waqaas used to pass from in front when the prayers was on. (Muwatta 55)
- No harm is done to prayers if someone passes from in front. (Muwatta 55)
- Rasoolullah said, “The prayer is broken if a woman, a donkey or a dog come in front.” (Muslim vol 2 pg 111)
THE HADITHI PUNCH LINE CONTINUED AND DEMOLISHED!
AGAIN, THE QUESTION IS: Do the 1.4 million Ahadith give us a complete, unified, method of NAMAZ (How to pray, ‘perform’ or ‘offer' NAMAZ?) The answer is a resounding NO!
- Hazrat Ayesha said, “You (narrators) have made us donkeys and dogs. By Allah! I used to be lying in front on the rug while Rasoolullah prayed. (Muslim vol 2 pg 111)
- Bukhari (Kitab-us-Salat, vol 1 pg 93) narrates four Ahadith that the Rasool (S) used to raise his hands up to the ears before bowing and also on rising from ‘Attahayyaat --.’ Why don’t the majority of Muslims do it?
- Rasoolullah used to combine Zuhr, ‘Asr, Maghrib and ‘Isha prayers without duress or travel. (Muwatta 51, Muslim vol 2 pg 265) Why can't we do it? Because of other contradictory Ahadith and the Fuqaha, the 'Jurists'.
- Mu’aawiyah bin Hakam was praying with Rasool (S). A praying one sneezed and I said the customary blessing, ‘Yarhamakallah’. The Rasool (S) told me after prayers, “Human words are not permissible during Salat.” (Muslim vol 2 pg 126)
- BUT - Once, the Satan came before Rasoolullah during Namaz and the Rasool (S) said three times, “Allah’s curse upon you!” (Muslim vol 2 pg 131) Human words, how’s that? And how about depicting the “Satan” as a physical entity rather than the Qur’anic ‘selfish desire’?
- The Rasool (S) was praying ‘Isha. After rising from rukoo’ he said, “O Allah! Have mercy on 'Ayyaash bin Abi Rabia’ah and other poor Muslims. Grasp the Al-Mudhar Tribe and send famine on them.” (Muslim vol 2 pg 236) Human words, aren't they? The exalted Prophet never prayed for infliction. He always prayed for guidance of people and wished well for all.
- Rasoolullah never used to raise hands in prayers except when praying for rains. (Bukhari vol 1 page 125)
- He always raised hands during any du'a. (References too many to point)
- Rasoolullah used to offer prayers with shoes on. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 55) [Can we? The Mullah drives out even a non-Muslim from the Masjid if he is wearing shoes]
- Sahaba used to pray even when bleeding from an arrow. (Bukhari vol 1 pg 32, Ibn Majah, Muslim, Nisaai & many other sources)
- Oozing of blood from anywhere in the body nullifies Wudhu or Salat. (Same sources and Fuqaha)
- Hazrat Anas states that Rasool (S) used to pray the briefest complete Namaz. (Muslim vol 2 pg 86)
- The Rasool (S) used to scold people who led long prayers. (Two Ahadith, Muslim vol 2 ppg 84, 85)
- BUT, Hazrat Anas states that Rasool (S) stood still so long after bowing (rukoo’) that the watcher thought he forgot (to proceed). The same used to happen after Sajdah (prostration). (Muslim vol 2 pg 87)
- Abu Saeed Khadri narrates: Rasoolullah’s prayer used to be so long that supposing the noon prayer has begun. A man walks to the graveyard of Baqee’, comes back home, makes ablution and goes to the Masjid. And he finds him still leading the first raka’at (unit). (Muslim vol 2 pg 48)
Then there are innumerable contradictions in what du’as the exalted Messenger used to recite and teach at each point in Namaz. (See Bukhari vol 1 ppg 99 to104, Muslim vol 2 ppg 43, 48, 90)
So, this is what the Hadith teaches us about Namaz:
1. If you have been snoring in sleep, you need not do Wudhu. Sorry, you do need Wudhu.
2. Cooked food will break your ablution, but, the roasted goat won’t.
3. Bleeding does not spoil Wudhu or prayers. Sorry, it does.
4. If there is no ejaculation, bath is not necessary. Sorry, it is necessary.
5. You can combine the noon, afternoon, evening and night prayers. Sorry, you cannot.
6. Don’t lift your hands for du’a. Do lift your hands for du’a.
7. Before Rukoo’, raise your hands to the shoulders. No, don’t.
8. Pray two units after ‘Asr. No, don’t.
9. You can pray with your child in your lap. You can’t do that (FIQH)
10. You can keep climbing up and down the stairs during Namaz. (No way! FIQH)
11. Only Al-Fatiha is enough for Namaz. Sorry, it’s not enough.
12. ‘Allahhumma’ can be read aloud. No, it cannot be read aloud. But, you can pray without it. No, never! You can’t pray without it.
13. You may curse the Satan during Namaz and pray for others. No, never!
14. Say anything after At-Tahiyyat that you want. No, only say this and this.
15. Kill anyone passing in front of the Namazis, but leave alone Hazraat Abdullah Ibn Abbas and Saad bin Abi Waqas.
16. If a woman, donkey, or dog passes from in front, the Namaz is broken. But if your wife is lying down on your prayer rug right in front, never mind.
So, this is the Salat or Namaz of Hadith. Can you pray at all according to Hadith? You claim Hadith tells you the method of Namaz. Then, which is the greater riddle; Hadith or your excellency?!
Namaaz
Am not talking about Osman/Bukhari/Ayesha.<BR>You mean to say we are the o­nly in rightpath.<BR>All muslim you name it Suni/Bohra/ Intasheris and more they all pray Namaaz.<BR>Have we <BR>ever prayed Namaaz in our Jamatkhans and when was it stoped?<BR><BR>
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star_munir
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In Quran word is Salat which means Dua. As told by ShamsB the word namaz is originally of parsis.
As for method of reciting prayer, we recite Dua because its by our Imam.
There was different prayer at different times. The namaz which non ismailis recite today was not Prayer since begining of world.
Today we recite Arabic Dua because its Farman of our Imam to do so.
As for method of reciting prayer, we recite Dua because its by our Imam.
There was different prayer at different times. The namaz which non ismailis recite today was not Prayer since begining of world.
Today we recite Arabic Dua because its Farman of our Imam to do so.
Re: Namaaz
Yes, we are the correct path!naushina wrote: Am not talking about Osman/Bukhari/Ayesha.
You mean to say we are the only in rightpath.
All muslim you name it Suni/Bohra/ Intasheris and more they all pray Namaaz.
Have we ever prayed Namaaz in our Jamatkhans and when was it stoped?
What good is namaz when the other namazi is considered a deviant and could be put to the sword.
For all shias, the Ahle bait Imam of the Time decides what constitutes a valid sunnah and the valid practise of Religion. See if you can Understand the following:
There is a vital difference in the nature of acceptable Sunnah for both Shais & Sunnis. The Shias accept only those hadith that have been reported by or attributed to the Ahl al-Bait or direct descendents of the Prophet (PBUH) thru Fatima & Ali, whereas the Sunnis authenticate all the hadith reported by any of the Prophet’s companions (PBUH).
Further, Shias include in their hadith collections not only statements attributed to the Prophet (PBUH) but also statements attributed to their Imams, whom they regard as infallible.
Unlike the Sunnis, the Shias therefore place, in effect, the authenticated sayings of their Imams on par with the sayings of the Prophet and of Allah as contained in the Quran.
Ya Ali Madad to All!
Salat is an Arabic word. In Quran, the book of Allah, revealed on Prophet (PBUH) uses the very word of SALAT when discussing prayers offered. Dua is a modified form of Salat. Nor Quran itself neither the Prophet (PBUH) used the very word of Namaz. even the names of Namaz i.e. Faj Zohar Asr Magrib n Isha arent mentioned anywhere.. these are the names we chose for our convenience.
Dua is Salat, its simply that we're not using the word SALAT extensively n r acquainted with the word of DUA. Regarding wht SALAT is, a man once enquired from Imam Jaffer Sadiq (A.S.) n was advised that SALAT is a word (conversation) b/w creator and creation n its a DIALOGUE n not monologue tat half of it is Allah's words n other half is urs. Tats our of our 7 part Dua, 3.5 is of Allah n 3.5 ours. Lets see.. we begin dua with Surah Fatiha... its Allah's Word... after tat its our word... similayl all sentenses in our dua tat begin with ALLAHUMA are words offered by us. The man further asked Imam Jaffer (A.S.) as to if there are any specifications for SALAT, Imam (A.S.) said Salat is not complete till it includes Surah Fatiha. tat is Sura Fatiha is mandatory for Salat, therefore if u compare NAMAZ or DUA... we have SUrah Fatiha.
Further not for the sake of comparision but to understand our DUA, Namaz has 7 raqaats, each part of dua serves as a Rakat. We offer equal sajoods (sajdas) as a non-ismaili does in 5 times prayers.
n if we try to understand our Dua... its the most precious gift of Imam. We begin with Surah FAtiha(Um-ul-Quran=Mother of Quran) n show our faith in Allah, then in second part we recite the prerequisites (Allah, Prophet, Aima=Ulil Amr)of faithful n request for mercy etc., then we talk abt announcement made by Prophet for Aima n agree no ones brave bur Ali n its just is sword, then after this entire link we make a comitment of Submission in fourth part and then in fifth part after making the commitment we accept that we are not supposed to do Khayanat... n then we accept Allah is AHAD n seek his mercy through Panjtan Paak n Aima.
i dont intend to get into explanation but i found it imp to mention the significance of DUA in relevance with the question under reference.
Salat is an Arabic word. In Quran, the book of Allah, revealed on Prophet (PBUH) uses the very word of SALAT when discussing prayers offered. Dua is a modified form of Salat. Nor Quran itself neither the Prophet (PBUH) used the very word of Namaz. even the names of Namaz i.e. Faj Zohar Asr Magrib n Isha arent mentioned anywhere.. these are the names we chose for our convenience.
Dua is Salat, its simply that we're not using the word SALAT extensively n r acquainted with the word of DUA. Regarding wht SALAT is, a man once enquired from Imam Jaffer Sadiq (A.S.) n was advised that SALAT is a word (conversation) b/w creator and creation n its a DIALOGUE n not monologue tat half of it is Allah's words n other half is urs. Tats our of our 7 part Dua, 3.5 is of Allah n 3.5 ours. Lets see.. we begin dua with Surah Fatiha... its Allah's Word... after tat its our word... similayl all sentenses in our dua tat begin with ALLAHUMA are words offered by us. The man further asked Imam Jaffer (A.S.) as to if there are any specifications for SALAT, Imam (A.S.) said Salat is not complete till it includes Surah Fatiha. tat is Sura Fatiha is mandatory for Salat, therefore if u compare NAMAZ or DUA... we have SUrah Fatiha.
Further not for the sake of comparision but to understand our DUA, Namaz has 7 raqaats, each part of dua serves as a Rakat. We offer equal sajoods (sajdas) as a non-ismaili does in 5 times prayers.
n if we try to understand our Dua... its the most precious gift of Imam. We begin with Surah FAtiha(Um-ul-Quran=Mother of Quran) n show our faith in Allah, then in second part we recite the prerequisites (Allah, Prophet, Aima=Ulil Amr)of faithful n request for mercy etc., then we talk abt announcement made by Prophet for Aima n agree no ones brave bur Ali n its just is sword, then after this entire link we make a comitment of Submission in fourth part and then in fifth part after making the commitment we accept that we are not supposed to do Khayanat... n then we accept Allah is AHAD n seek his mercy through Panjtan Paak n Aima.
i dont intend to get into explanation but i found it imp to mention the significance of DUA in relevance with the question under reference.
arzimood, you are wrong!!
It is very shameful that no one has corrected this yet.
It is very shameful that no one has corrected this yet.
DUA has 6 Parts to it.arzimood wrote: Tats our of our 7 part Dua, 3.5 is of Allah n 3.5 ours.
Salaat a.k.a Namaz has 2 obligatory rakats (this is not the same for Salaat of Feasts or EID and Salaat offering or Namaaz of passing). However, the daily Salaat is offered with 4 rakats; the 3rd is in behalf of the Prophet (in Suni tradition and in Shia tradition it encompasses the entire family, Ah Al Bait) and the 4th is personal prayer.arzimood wrote: Further not for the sake of comparision but to understand our DUA, Namaz has 7 raqaats, each part of dua serves as a Rakat.
I think you meant 7 suras of the quran versus parts?arzimood wrote:7 was a typing mistake. I guess everyone here knows its 6 parts n so do i!! secondly... after all obligatory n those of sunnat at max there are 6 Rakats n we offer equal n ta too are obligatory. i guess ur post could have sounded cordial if it was posted to point out a typographical mistake.
there are 7 suras embedded in our dua, which i guess can equate to 7 rakats.
Shams
Thanks for understanding and not reacting to typographical mistakes. I meant the parts themselves... each part serves as a RAKAT. n this i heard from prominent n reliable alwa'az here in khi. tat is each part serves as a Rakaat. What all i was trying to make a point out of my post was tat Its Salaat as defined in Islam first form of Salaat was Namaz n dua is wht we offer as Sala'at today n i tried to highlight the resemblance between wht Prophet introduced n wht we offer today... the main things are still the same.
Point well taken, but still it is imperative that one must be diligent with their statements if one is going to go a step ahead and do the math i.e. 3.5 + 3.5 =7, that is not a "typing mistake" or "typographical mistake". I think it was not even the count of sura(s); it was the symbolic attachment to 7 that many folks have.arzimood wrote:tat is each part serves as a Rakaat. What all i was trying to make a point out of my post was tat Its Salaat as defined in Islam first form of Salaat was Namaz n dua is wht we offer as Sala'at today n i tried to highlight the resemblance between wht Prophet introduced n wht we offer today... the main things are still the same.
Even though the intent for the offering is the same; there are just as many similarities between Salaat and Dua as there are differences.
Again, there are 4 Rakats in Salaat not 6 or 7. Please re-read my previous post on this topic.
The following are some salient facts about Salat that I compiled while I was at the I.I.S.
Salat: Prayer is a fundamental principle of Islam. This principle is universally accepted by all schools within Islam. The principle is prescribed in the Quran. The form and times of prayer not stated categorically.
In accordance with the traditions of the Prophet, the majority of the Muslims perform their ritual prayers 5 times a day.
1. Fajr - Dawn (2 Rakahs)
2. Zuhr - Noon (4 Rakahs)
3. Asr - Approximately 11/2 hr after noon. (4 Rakahs)
4. Mghrib - Sunset (3 Rakahs)
5. Ishaa - 11/2 hr after sunset (4 Rakahs)
The Shias combine 2&3 and 4&5, resulting in three times prayer.
2 kinds of Salat: compulsory (Fard)/ optional
Compulsory - 5 times and Jumah congregation
Eid Prayers - highly recommended by the Prophet.
Basic unit of prayer is a Rakah. It comprises of:
a) Takbiratu-i-ihram.
In it you declare your intent (Niyat). Whether you are performing an obligatory or optional prayer, or whether you are performing Idd Prayer.
b) Tawwaudh: Audhu bi lahi min shaitan nir ra jim (I seek refuge from the devil and the evil spirits)
c) Surat-al Fateha - Important
d) Any other sura ( difference between Shia and Sunni). The Shia insist on a full Sura whereas the Sunnis can say partial.
e) Kunut in the 2nd Rakah
f) Ruku - Half prostration
g) Sujud - full prostration (twice)
The Salat ends with:
Tashahhud - Shahada followed by salwaat
Salaam
If we consider a part of Dua as equivalent/comparable to a Rakah, then we recite 3 X 6 = 18 rakahs per day. This is one rakah more than 2 + 4 + 4 + 3 + 4 = 17 rakahs performed during five times salat.
Salat: Prayer is a fundamental principle of Islam. This principle is universally accepted by all schools within Islam. The principle is prescribed in the Quran. The form and times of prayer not stated categorically.
In accordance with the traditions of the Prophet, the majority of the Muslims perform their ritual prayers 5 times a day.
1. Fajr - Dawn (2 Rakahs)
2. Zuhr - Noon (4 Rakahs)
3. Asr - Approximately 11/2 hr after noon. (4 Rakahs)
4. Mghrib - Sunset (3 Rakahs)
5. Ishaa - 11/2 hr after sunset (4 Rakahs)
The Shias combine 2&3 and 4&5, resulting in three times prayer.
2 kinds of Salat: compulsory (Fard)/ optional
Compulsory - 5 times and Jumah congregation
Eid Prayers - highly recommended by the Prophet.
Basic unit of prayer is a Rakah. It comprises of:
a) Takbiratu-i-ihram.
In it you declare your intent (Niyat). Whether you are performing an obligatory or optional prayer, or whether you are performing Idd Prayer.
b) Tawwaudh: Audhu bi lahi min shaitan nir ra jim (I seek refuge from the devil and the evil spirits)
c) Surat-al Fateha - Important
d) Any other sura ( difference between Shia and Sunni). The Shia insist on a full Sura whereas the Sunnis can say partial.
e) Kunut in the 2nd Rakah
f) Ruku - Half prostration
g) Sujud - full prostration (twice)
The Salat ends with:
Tashahhud - Shahada followed by salwaat
Salaam
If we consider a part of Dua as equivalent/comparable to a Rakah, then we recite 3 X 6 = 18 rakahs per day. This is one rakah more than 2 + 4 + 4 + 3 + 4 = 17 rakahs performed during five times salat.
Last edited by kmaherali on Wed Jul 26, 2006 1:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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zubair_mahamood
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YAM
1) Farz Namaz is compulsory and denial of which renders one a non Muslim.
2) Sunnah Namaz is optional and are those practiced by the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
3) Nafil Namaz is optional and regarded as extra prayers which bring more reward.
4) Wajib Namaz is compulsory and denial of which renders one a sinner.
In Fajr Namaz they are total 4 rakahs [2 rakahs Farz and 2 rakahs Sunnah].
In Zuhr Namaz they are total 12 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In Asr Namaz they are 8 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah and 4 rakahs Farz].
In Mghrib Namaz they are 7 rakahs [3 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In Ishaa Namaz they are 17 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah, 2 rakahs Nafil, 3 rakahs Vitter and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In general Sunnies and Shias offer all four namaz accordance with The day. sjd
MH
Here we are missing few points. They are three types of namaz performed in a day and on every Friday or on Eid’s a special Namaz called Wajib is performed that cannot be offered alone.kmaherali wrote:Salaam
If we consider a part of Dua as equivalent to a Rakah, then we recite
3 X 6 = 18 rakahs per day. This is one rakah more than 2 + 4 + 4 + 3 + 4 = 17 rakahs performed during five times salat.
1) Farz Namaz is compulsory and denial of which renders one a non Muslim.
2) Sunnah Namaz is optional and are those practiced by the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
3) Nafil Namaz is optional and regarded as extra prayers which bring more reward.
4) Wajib Namaz is compulsory and denial of which renders one a sinner.
In Fajr Namaz they are total 4 rakahs [2 rakahs Farz and 2 rakahs Sunnah].
In Zuhr Namaz they are total 12 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In Asr Namaz they are 8 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah and 4 rakahs Farz].
In Mghrib Namaz they are 7 rakahs [3 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In Ishaa Namaz they are 17 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah, 2 rakahs Nafil, 3 rakahs Vitter and 2 rakahs Nafil].
In general Sunnies and Shias offer all four namaz accordance with The day. sjd
MH
This shows that it is difficult to arrive at a consensus even on the basic principle of faith. How difficult then would it be to arrive at a consensus on other aspects of life? Hence the need for a living authority.zubair_mahamood wrote: Here we are missing few points. They are three types of namaz performed in a day and on every Friday or on Eid’s a special Namaz called Wajib is performed that cannot be offered alone.
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zubair_mahamood
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I am very glad to see both posts by kmaherali and zubair_mahamood. I hope you both continue to post facts with personal research and not just quote someone whom you had heard speak. I think there is a greater need for folks to do fact checking when posting here because folks read things and posts things and it gets repeated/propagated when it may not always be the case, hence giving birth to rumors, myths and legends.
Now back to the topic at hand, I agree there is more than one way to offer thanks, beg for mercy or beg for blessings and it further pronounces the pluralism and emphasizes that Islam not monolithic faith therefore, one should not compare or contrast their rituals for the sake of satisfying/justify some compliances.
Now back to the topic at hand, I agree there is more than one way to offer thanks, beg for mercy or beg for blessings and it further pronounces the pluralism and emphasizes that Islam not monolithic faith therefore, one should not compare or contrast their rituals for the sake of satisfying/justify some compliances.
Salam alaikum wa ya Ali Madad (what is the answer to this?),
this isn`t right:
Can somebody please post your Dia, which you recite?
I`m truley interested in....
with greetings
wa salam
Semanur
this isn`t right:
We, Sunni- Muslims, have to read a short, but completely sura, too.d) Any other sura ( difference between Shia and Sunni). The Shia insist on a full Sura whereas the Sunnis can say partial.
Can somebody please post your Dia, which you recite?
I`m truley interested in....
with greetings
wa salam
Semanur
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zubair_mahamood
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- Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 6:12 pm
- Contact:
Re: NAMAAZ
YAM
Then people in Middle east who do salaat are fine and on Allah words, so just let me tell you that in every corner of world every Sunni Muslim pray to Allah in same manner. I am born in India, visited Middle East, and living in Europe. I had opportunity to go to different mosques; I have never felt any change in Namaz, the different was culture and nature or belief of peoples.
And since when we have complete knowledge of Holy Quran? Coming to our basic belief of faith that Quran is Zahir and Batine, it’s Imam who tells us the meaning according to time and need of his Murids.
4 surahs x 5 times a day = 20 surahs per day is completly wrong.. Take a calculator.
In Fajr Namaz they are total 4 rakahs [2 rakahs Farz and 2 rakahs Sunnah]. Surah+surah= total surah { 4 + 4 = 8 }
In Zuhr Namaz they are total 12 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8 + 6 + 4 + 4 = 22 }
In Asr Namaz they are 8 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah and 4 rakahs Farz]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8+ 6 = 14 }
In Mghrib Namaz they are 7 rakahs [3 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 5 + 4 + 4 = 13 }
In Ishaa Namaz they are 17 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah, 2 rakahs Nafil, 3 rakahs Vitter and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8 + 6 + 4 + 4 + 6 + 4 = 32 }
Let’s calculate Total surahs in all Namaz 8 + 22 + 14 + 13 + 32 = ?.
So u tell me which has more sawab?
In generally all Sunni Muslims follow this Patten of Namaz weather living in east or west depending on individuals belief. For me I haven’t seen my parents and elders missing any Namaz and those who do Namaz regular will at least do 5 Farz namaz a day.
Let’s calculate surahs only in Farz Namaz 4 + 6 + 6 + 5 + 6 = 27
So u tell me which has more sawab?
Dear Brother its not Dua or Namaz which is superior. It’s Allah, Whose word is superior which make his creatures superior. I think most of Ismailies have never read about Prophet Muhammad. I advice you all to have knowledge of The Last prophet Muhammad; I believe that the only person who has complete Knowledge of Allah is Prophet Muhammad. Mowlana Ali shared his complete Knowledge with him and we have no knowledge about them. The only person who can guide us is MHI.
May Mowlana Hazar Imam give us knowledge which can lead us to reach him. SJD
Zubair
shams I m sorry, I totally disagree with you. Let's take that Namaz is not mention in Quran and Salaat and Dua are mention. That means people doing salaat and Dua are following Allah word and people doing Namaz aren’t.ShamsB wrote:Namaaz has never been mentioned in the Qu'ran..dua and salaat have been mentioned..naushina wrote:Hii
am talking about Praying NAMAAZ not Reciting Dua
Whats the differnt between Dua n Namaaz.
Can anybody explain to me please?
Then people in Middle east who do salaat are fine and on Allah words, so just let me tell you that in every corner of world every Sunni Muslim pray to Allah in same manner. I am born in India, visited Middle East, and living in Europe. I had opportunity to go to different mosques; I have never felt any change in Namaz, the different was culture and nature or belief of peoples.
And since when we have complete knowledge of Holy Quran? Coming to our basic belief of faith that Quran is Zahir and Batine, it’s Imam who tells us the meaning according to time and need of his Murids.
I am sorry again. Do we have 7 Surahs in Dua? According to me there is difference between Surahs and Verses or an Ayath of Quran.ShamsB wrote: also if you count the number of Quranic surahs recited in the 5 time namaz i.e. 4 surahs x 5 times a day = 20 surahs per day..
look at the dua...7 surahs x 3 times a day = 21 surahs per day]
which has more sawab?.....
4 surahs x 5 times a day = 20 surahs per day is completly wrong.. Take a calculator.
In Fajr Namaz they are total 4 rakahs [2 rakahs Farz and 2 rakahs Sunnah]. Surah+surah= total surah { 4 + 4 = 8 }
In Zuhr Namaz they are total 12 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8 + 6 + 4 + 4 = 22 }
In Asr Namaz they are 8 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah and 4 rakahs Farz]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8+ 6 = 14 }
In Mghrib Namaz they are 7 rakahs [3 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 5 + 4 + 4 = 13 }
In Ishaa Namaz they are 17 rakahs [4 rakahs Sunnah, 4 rakahs Farz, 2 rakahs Sunnah, 2 rakahs Nafil, 3 rakahs Vitter and 2 rakahs Nafil]. Surah+surah= total surah { 8 + 6 + 4 + 4 + 6 + 4 = 32 }
Let’s calculate Total surahs in all Namaz 8 + 22 + 14 + 13 + 32 = ?.
So u tell me which has more sawab?
In generally all Sunni Muslims follow this Patten of Namaz weather living in east or west depending on individuals belief. For me I haven’t seen my parents and elders missing any Namaz and those who do Namaz regular will at least do 5 Farz namaz a day.
Let’s calculate surahs only in Farz Namaz 4 + 6 + 6 + 5 + 6 = 27
So u tell me which has more sawab?
Dear Brother its not Dua or Namaz which is superior. It’s Allah, Whose word is superior which make his creatures superior. I think most of Ismailies have never read about Prophet Muhammad. I advice you all to have knowledge of The Last prophet Muhammad; I believe that the only person who has complete Knowledge of Allah is Prophet Muhammad. Mowlana Ali shared his complete Knowledge with him and we have no knowledge about them. The only person who can guide us is MHI.
May Mowlana Hazar Imam give us knowledge which can lead us to reach him. SJD
Zubair
Re: NAMAAZ
And it is the same farman of this Hazar Imam that says RECITE DUA...and understand it's meaning....nowhere does he say recite Namaz....zubair_mahamood wrote:YAMDear Brother its not Dua or Namaz which is superior. It’s Allah, Whose word is superior which make his creatures superior. I think most of Ismailies have never read about Prophet Muhammad. I advice you all to have knowledge of The Last prophet Muhammad; I believe that the only person who has complete Knowledge of Allah is Prophet Muhammad. Mowlana Ali shared his complete Knowledge with him and we have no knowledge about them. The only person who can guide us is MHI.ShamsB wrote:Namaaz has never been mentioned in the Qu'ran..dua and salaat have been mentioned..naushina wrote:Hii
am talking about Praying NAMAAZ not Reciting Dua
Whats the differnt between Dua n Namaaz.
Can anybody explain to me please?
May Mowlana Hazar Imam give us knowledge which can lead us to reach him. SJD
Zubair
Ismailism is based on one thing and one thing only..that is the IMAM...we have given baiyat to follow that Imam..He says..recite dua..i recite dua..
he says wear spandex to JK and sing Madonna songs...I will be there...
you have to accept that first and foremost...than all your questions will be answered of their own accord.....
S.
Imam Jaffar Sadiq Ma Bap has said that the one who martyred Imam Husseyn Ma Bap, and who was the damned Shimar, had declared while killing Mowla: "I practise Namaz and I must hasten to martyr you as I have to go say my evening Namaz". Look how evil he was: He had come to martyr Imam-e-Zaman, and on the other side, he said "I cannot miss the Namaz"!
He who does not know his Imam, no matter the number of Namaz and fastings he accomplishes, it will do him no good. Those who are the slaves of the Namaz, and who draw their sword against Imam-e-Zaman, are doomed to Hell.
Aga Ali Shah quoting Mowlana Jafar Sadiq on the subject of Namaz On 3rd of the Month of Bhadar Ashoud 1934 of the Samvat Calendar (1877 A.D.)
He who does not know his Imam, no matter the number of Namaz and fastings he accomplishes, it will do him no good. Those who are the slaves of the Namaz, and who draw their sword against Imam-e-Zaman, are doomed to Hell.
Aga Ali Shah quoting Mowlana Jafar Sadiq on the subject of Namaz On 3rd of the Month of Bhadar Ashoud 1934 of the Samvat Calendar (1877 A.D.)